The Purpose of the Law

[Alan Stevens]

Hi

Not wanting to go over 'old' ground.

I having been thinking over 'What was the purpose of the Law?'

Going back to Dr Martyn Lloyd-Jones In Romans :
I Quote: -

The Law was never given in order to save us. "The Law was given through Moses, to give us 'the knowledge of sin.' Not to deliver us from sin, but to give us the knowledge of its terrible character,"

In other words, the whole function of the Law is to define sin, to reveal its nature; and that is why we are without any excuse at all. The law is in our hearts; but that is not clear enough, so God made it explicit. He had defined it, He has underlined it, He has shown it plainly in the written Law give to the Jews.

. . . The Law was given to pinpoint sin, to define it, to bring it out of its hiding-place and to show its exceeding sinful character. . . Nothing so shows the exceeding sinfulness of sin as the Law itself does; and once a man has seen the real meaning of the Law he sees the foulness, the vileness of his own nature.

. . . The Law was never given to save man, but it was given as a "school-master" to bring him to the Savior. The whole object and purpose of the Law is to show man that he can never save himself. Once he has understood the Law and its spiritual meaning and content he knows that he cannot keep it. He is undone. . . What is the summary of the Law? It is: "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and all thy soul, and all thy mind, and all thy strength; and thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself." Has anyone done that and so kept the Law? No, "All have sinned and come short of the glory of God." That is what the Law says. It shows us our utter helplessness and hopelessness, and thereby it becomes "our schoolmaster to lead us to Christ," the only One Who by the grace of God can save us, and deliver us, and reconcile us to God, and make us safe for all eternity. Paul glories in the Gospel which proclaims that "the just shall live by faith," because "by the deeds of the law shall no flesh be justified in His sight, because by the law is the knowledge of sin"

(Romans Exposition Chapters 3:20-4:24, pp 21-22).

I hope this helps?

Cheers

[Odyssey]

Hey Alan,

The only thing that I would add to your post would be that the Law was never given (nor intended, IMHO) for Gentiles. This is clearly pointed out in In Romans 2 where Paul wrote:

'For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; {13}(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. {14}For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: {15}Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another)' Rom. 2.12-15

If we look at the messages to the Gentiles, they do not go over the Law of Moses. The only time (of which I am aware) that Paul brings up the Law is to correct the Gentiles who were being led astray by the Judaizers (who, according to Paul in Galatians, were just Jews).

Therefore, the Law was given to the Jews to lead them to Christ.

Grace to you,

jak

[Brandan Kraft]

Od, it always gets me in a tizzle when I hear people say, "You must preach law before the gospel." In fact, I want to scream when I hear that.

I agree, the Law was meant and only meant for the Jews. We believers have a new law.. The law of Christ, and it is written on our hearts.

Brandan

[Alan Stevens]

Hi

It took a while, but i do agree with both of you.

I had to consider just what i thought as against what i have been told.

My mind in these matters always comes back to the story of Rahab, who was made righteous through her faith. She was a gentile, who did not know the law, but acted because she placed her trust and faith in God.

Consider verses 10-12

Josuha 2
9 and said to the men: "I know that the LORD has given you the land, that the terror of you has fallen on us, and that all the inhabitants of the land are fainthearted because of you.
10 "For we have heard how the LORD dried up the water of the Red Sea for you when you came out of Egypt, and what you did to the two kings of the Amorites who were on the other side of the Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom you utterly destroyed.
11 "And as soon as we heard these things, our hearts melted; neither did there remain any more courage in anyone because of you, for the LORD your God, He is God in heaven above and on earth beneath.
12 "Now therefore, I beg you, swear to me by the LORD, since I have shown you kindness, that you also will show kindness to my father's house, and give me a true token,
13 "and spare my father, my mother, my brothers, my sisters, and all that they have, and deliver our lives from death."
14 So the men answered her, "Our lives for yours, if none of you tell this business of ours. And it shall be, when the LORD has given us the land, that we will deal kindly and truly with you."
15 Then she let them down by a rope through the window, for her house was on the city wall; she dwelt on the wall.
16 And she said to them, "Get to the mountain, lest the pursuers meet you. Hide there three days, until the pursuers have returned. Afterward you may go your way."
17 Then the men said to her: "We will be blameless of this oath of yours which you have made us swear,
18 "unless, when we come into the land, you bind this line of scarlet cord in the window through which you let us down, and unless you bring your father, your mother, your brothers, and all your father's household to your own home.
19 "So it shall be that whoever goes outside the doors of your house into the street, his blood shall be on his own head, and we will be guiltless. And whoever is with you in the house, his blood shall be on our head if a hand is laid on him.
20 "And if you tell this business of ours, then we will be free from your oath which you made us swear."
21 Then she said, "According to your words, so be it." And she sent them away, and they departed. And she bound the scarlet cord in the window.

It is interesting how the church can take the Law, which was mean't for Isreal and adapt it to an evangelical message to suit needs.

The good news of the Gospel is that God, through Christ, has given us free access to himself and placed his words in our hearts.

Cheers

[disciple]

I had to consider just what i thought as against what i have been told.

i know what you mean. after leaving dispensationalism and entering reformed circles, i had understood law to have three uses: 1) civil - to maintain external discipline against unruly and disobedient men, 2) evangelical - to lead men to a knowledge of their sin, 3) after they are reborn, and although the flesh still inheres in them, to give them on that account a definite rule according to which they should pattern and regulate their entire life. http://www.frii.com/~gosplow/lgcs.html
while perhaps for the Jews, the law of Moses may have done these things and while just plain law will do #1 i never thought of how Scripture actually used the term. it wasn't until i understood that the law of Moses was a unit (you can split it in pieces, etc.) that i realized that this splitting of the law was bogus. i also had to realize that splitting the law into moral, civil, and ceremonial was bogus. then after i took my goggles off i could go to the Scripture and see what the purpose of the law of Moses was and how it applied to me.

[Alan Stevens]

Hi

Thanks Disciple

It's interesting how you can read a lot of books, listen to a lot of preaching and be come slowly brain washed, without even knowing it!!

One of the things i have most appreciated about this forum, is the honesty and differing views of the members. My view of many things has been challenged and that can only be a good thing, It has certainly made me think and revisit many things that i had been told.

Cheers, Thanks again.

[Alan Stevens]

Hi

On the subject of whether the law was preached to the gentiles to convict them.

Look at Acts 17

Then Paul stood in the midst of the Areopagus and said, "Men of Athens, I perceive that in all things you are very religious;
23 "for as I was passing through and considering the objects of your worship, I even found an altar with this inscription: to the unknown God. Therefore, the One whom you worship without knowing, Him I proclaim to you:
24 "God, who made the world and everything in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands.
25 "Nor is He worshiped with men's hands, as though He needed anything, since He gives to all life, breath, and all things.
26 "And He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their habitation,
27 "so that they should seek the Lord, in the hope that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us;
28 "for in Him we live and move and have our being, as also some of your own poets have said, 'For we are also His offspring.'
29 "Therefore, since we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, something shaped by art and man's devising.
30 "Truly, these times of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent,
31 "because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead."
32 And when they heard of the resurrection of the dead, some mocked, while others said, "We will hear you again on this matter."
33 So Paul departed from among them.


Paul seemed not to use the law, but taught them in relationship to their own practices and customs. Perhaps a lesson for us !!

Cheers

[disciple]

but it is also evident that there are elements of the law that are instructional for the Christian (ro 7:7, 13:9; Eph 6:2) but Gentiles are never said to be under it or of it. so in a sense, there are principles of the law that still apply but the main purpose of the law of Moses as a unit was to kill, condemn, and curse:



Decision for the Gentiles (Under the Law or Not?)

Acts 15:1 Some men came down from Judea and began teaching the brethren, "Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved."...5 But some of the sect of the Pharisees who had believed stood up, saying, "It is necessary to circumcise them and to direct them to observe the Law of Moses (not just circumcision but the entire Law of Moses)." 6 The apostles and the elders came together to look into this matter...10 "Now therefore why do you put God to the test by placing upon the neck of the disciples a yoke (i.e., the Law; not just circumcision) which neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?...19 "Therefore it is my judgment that we do not trouble those who are turning to God from among the Gentiles,


Law and Gentiles

Romans 2:14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, (purpose of any law is to point out that which is wrong; while the Jews have the Law Gentiles also do the things of the Law because of their conscience which also points out that which is wrong)

Knowledge of Sin

Romans 3:19 Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law (i.e., Jews; Gentiles were never said to be under the Law), so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God; 20 because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.

Law Brings Wrath

Rom 4:15 for the Law brings about wrath, but where there is no law, there also is no violation.

Sin Imputed Through the Law

Rom 5:13 for until the Law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law...20 The Law came in so that the transgression would increase; but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,

Sin Kills Through the Law

Romans 7

Audience Defined

1 Or do you not know, brethren (for I am speaking to those who know the law), that the law has jurisdiction over a person as long as he lives? 2 For the married woman is bound by law to her husband while he is living; but if her husband dies, she is released from the law concerning the husband. 3 So then, if while her husband is living she is joined to another man, she shall be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from the law, so that she is not an adulteress though she is joined to another man. 4 Therefore my brethren, you also (like vv. 2-3), were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ (because of what Christ did; cf. Gal 3:13), so that you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God.

How sin uses the Law

5 For while we were in the flesh, the sinful passions, which were aroused by the Law, were at work in the members of our body to bear fruit for death. 6 But now we (i.e., Jews, v. 1) have been released from the Law (Gentiles we never under its custody), having died to that by which we (i.e., Jews, v. 1) were bound, so that we serve in newness of the Spirit and not in oldness of the letter. 7 What shall we say then? Is the Law sin? May it never be! On the contrary, I would not have come to know sin except through the Law (the Law pointed out sin or made it known); for I would not have known about coveting if the Law had not said, "You shall not covet." 8 But sin, taking opportunity through the commandment, produced in me coveting of every kind; for apart from the Law sin is dead. 9 I was once alive apart from the Law; but when the commandment came, sin became alive and I died; 10 and this commandment, which was to result in life, proved to result in death for me; 11 for sin, taking an opportunity through the commandment, deceived me and through it (means of killing) killed me. 12 (answering question in v. 7) So then, the Law is holy, and the commandment is holy and righteous and good. (it is good, holy, and righteous because it defines sin and points out that which is bad, unholy, unrighteous) 13 Therefore did that which is good become a cause of death for me? May it never be! Rather it was sin, in order that it might be shown to be sin by effecting my death through (means) that which is good, so that through (means) the commandment sin would become utterly sinful. 14 For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am of flesh, sold into bondage to sin. 15 For what I am doing, I do not understand; for I am not practicing what I would like to do, but I am doing the very thing I hate. 16 But if I do the very thing I do not want to do I agree with the Law, confessing that the Law is good. (the Law made sin known and was not what actually did the killing. the Law killed in that when the person sinned, the Law showed that the person was sinful and sinning and pointed that sin out thereby killing. so what actually did the killing was the sin. the Law made it possible because through it sin is pointed out.)

Paul, a Jew, was no longer under the Law

1 Cor 9:20 To the Jews I became as a Jew, so that I might win Jews; to those who are under the Law, as under the Law though not being myself under the Law, so that I might win those who are under the Law;..21 to those who are without law, as without law, though not being without the law of God but under the law of Christ (he's now under a different law; not the Law of Moses), so that I might win those who are without law.

Ministry of the Covenants

2 Co 3:6 who also made us adequate as servants of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. 7 But if the ministry of death, in letters engraved on stones, came with glory, so that the sons of Israel could not look intently at the face of Moses because of the glory of his face, fading as it was, 8 how will the ministry of the Spirit fail to be even more with glory? 9 For if the ministry of condemnation has glory, much more does the ministry of righteousness abound in glory. 10 For indeed what had glory, in this case has no glory because of the glory that surpasses it. 11 For if that which fades away was with glory, much more that which remains is in glory.

Tutelage of the Law

Gal 3

He speaks to/of the Jews

10 For as many as are of the works of the Law (this was Jews only; Gentiles would not have fallen into this category) are under a curse; for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who does not abide by all things written in the book of the law, to perform them."...13 Christ redeemed us (those who were of the works of the Law; i.e., Jews) from the curse of the Law, having become a curse for us (i.e., Jews; v. 10) for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree" 14 in order that (this speaks to purpose) in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles (this is how it applies to non-Jews or those who were not of the works of the Law; v. 10) , so that we would receive the promise of the Spirit through faith...19 Why the Law then? It was added because of transgressions, having been ordained through angels by the agency of a mediator, until (suggests a terminus) the seed would come to whom the promise had been made...23 But before faith came, we (i.e., Jews) were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed. 24 Therefore the Law has become our (i.e., Jews; v. 10) tutor to lead us (i.e., Jews; v. 10) to Christ (i.e, Messiah), so that we (i.e., Jews; v. 10) may be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we (i.e., Jews; v. 10) are no longer under a tutor.

He speaks to/of Jews and Gentiles

26 For you are all (referring to the entire audience, Jews and Gentiles) sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For all of you (i.e., Jews and Gentiles) who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus (there is no longer division as there was the in Old Covenant; e.g., Jew/Gentile, Slave/Free, Man/Women). 29 And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's descendants, heirs according to promise. (Paul extends the family of Abraham and the promise to Abraham beyond his physical descendents and those who were of the works of the Law).

No More Division

Ephesians 2:11 Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called "Uncircumcision" by the so-called "Circumcision," which is performed in the flesh by human hands 12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now (i love that phrase!) in Christ Jesus you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. 14 For He Himself is our peace, who made both groups into one and broke down the barrier of the dividing wall, 15 by (this is how He did it) abolishing in His flesh the enmity, which is the Law of commandments contained in ordinances (this describes the enmity which was the Law; this agrees with 2 Co 3 and Gal 3), so that (this speaks to purpose) in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thus establishing peace, 16 and might reconcile them both in one body to God through the cross, by it having put to death the enmity (v. 15). 17 And He came and preached peace to you who were far away (i.e., Gentiles), and peace to those who were near (i.e., Jews); 18 for through Him we both (i.e., Jews and Gentiles) have our access in one Spirit to the Father. 19 So then you (i.e., Gentiles) are no longer strangers and aliens, but (i love that word!) you are fellow citizens with the saints, and are of God's household, 20 having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the corner stone 21 in whom the whole building, being fitted together, is growing into a holy temple in the Lord, 22 in whom you also are being built together into a dwelling of God in the Spirit...3:6 to be specific that the Gentiles are fellow heirs and fellow members of the body, and fellow partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus through the gospel,

[disciple]

here's an interesting article that relates:
http://www.razormouth.com/cgi-local/...&id=1014622088

the only problem is that the author sees the Law of Moses as the only thing which convicts of sin and leads to Christ. but the fact of the matter is that people were sinful before the Law was ever given. how could they have been saved if they didn't have the Law of Moses (presumabley we're only talking about the decalogue here; what some call "the Moral Law")? while Law has this use for those who were under it (i.e., Jews) it should have no place in our preaching of the gospel. i would like to see someone who adheres to this view of the gospel show how any of the apostles used this formula. as far as i can see from reading the book of acts that the jews never did this when telling the gentiles of the good news.

[Odyssey]

Amen and Amen!

jak

[Alan Stevens]

Hi

Well this has had me thinking all night !!

Stephen Brown in his book "When being Good ins't Good Enough" Says this about the purpose of the Law.

The law shows us 4 Things:

1. The Parameters of God's Desire

2. It's a Measure by which we can determine progress.

3. The law is a teacher, that can bring us to Christ.

4. It's a Road Map to inform us where the mine fields are.

But the law is NOT and should not be used as:

1. The Law does not save - It is inappropiate to use the law as a means of getting to God.

2. The Law does not sanctify - It is inappropiate to use the law as a means of staying close to God.

3. The law does not reflect the heart - It is inappropiate to use the law as a measure of spirituality.

4. The law is not a weapon - It is inappropiate to use the law as a weapon against other members of the family of God.

5. The law does not make you superior - It is inappropiate to use the law as a way of setting ourselves on a pedestal with a divine calling to create others in our own image.

Food for thought ?

Cheers

[Brandan Kraft]

I'm going to have to bookmark this thread...

Oh, might I suggest Searching Together's latest issue.... It covers this topic quite well!

http://www.searchingtogether.org

Brandan