Expository Studies

[lionovjudah]

Brandan, moderators et al:

Is there an opportunity to provide a forum section where we can study Gods word from an expository standpoint instead of topical?

We apeak of Decrees, justification, predestination, election, free will, well meant offer, common grace.. etc etc etc all the time.

Can we have a section that will go verse by verse precept by precept in one book and go throught it? This would be a tremendous benefit in my feeble estimation.

Unless of course all can be summed up as "God did it in eternity!!!!" lol


Joe

[Brandan Kraft]

I'm not too keen on the idea.

[Ugly_Gaunt_Cow]

Unless of course all can be summed up as "God did it in eternity!!!!" lol

Well, didn't He?

[lionovjudah]

I'm not too keen on the idea.

WHy not? What would be wrong with starting in a book and going through it verse by verse, isnt that how teaching and study should be done?

[lionovjudah]

Well, didn't He?

Good one scott!!!!!! Touche'!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Brandan Kraft]

WHy not? What would be wrong with starting in a book and going through it verse by verse, isnt that how teaching and study should be done?

I believe teaching in the Bible is primarily topical and systematic. Take the book of Romans for example. We discuss systematic theology here. Anyway, I do not think it would work in a forum setting. I prefer to continue have the types of discussions that we've had in the past.

[Ugly_Gaunt_Cow]

I guess the best way to study one's bible is to ask the following questions...

- Who?
- What?
- Why?
- Where?
& When?

I'm amazed at how much I can learn form simply taking my time and reading slowly. I'm also amazed at how much I read when I stop trying to "entertain" myself.

It's usually after a night of solid reading that I need to ask questions and share new insights/misunderstandings with everyone here. Generally, my personal study is what fuels my inaction on this board - most of the time.

[ray kikkert]

Joe , go to the eschaton thread. There is much Scripture quoted here. It keeps me busy anyways

[lionovjudah]

Joe , go to the eschaton thread. There is much Scripture quoted here. It keeps me busy anyways

Ray, my problem there is I have never been moved to study eschatology. Perhaps this is the time then

[lionovjudah]

I believe teaching in the Bible is primarily topical and systematic. Take the book of Romans for example. We discuss systematic theology here. Anyway, I do not think it would work in a forum setting. I prefer to continue have the types of discussions that we've had in the past.

What about a parable study then brandan? I am not looking or asking to change the WHOLE forum. lol

I mean, that is what men have written commentaries about, verse by verse, not only topical.

The systematic we study is 2 themes.

1) God decreed
2) Read rule # 1


HAHAHAHAHA

[ray kikkert]

You laugh Joe , but that is exactly it. I cannot for the life of me determine to discuss any topic under the sun without first acknowledging and understanding that it is all subservient to the sovereign purpose of God.

Try it Joe. Go to any book, chapter, verse and explain it apart from God's sovereign purpose. It becomes idolatry to which we are prone.

Anyways, I would encourage you Joe to seek out the study of eschatology. I mean truth be told, I pray that the Lord would come quickly. To live is Christ, to die is gain.

[L-Today]

Joe,

Study of any verse or a passage will lead into the Biblical systematic theology anyway, because it MUST belong to one or more Scriptural doctrines. No verse just sits there in a vacuum by itself, minding its own business. The Bible is One unbroken Word of God, every doctrine relates perfectly to other doctrines and to the whole Bible, and therefore we can never study a verse without considering the rest of the Bible.

If Brandan will allow, you can try - bring a small passage of your choice, and the brothers will help you see its connection to other teachings and to the rest of the beautiful system.

Please go on www.trinityfoundation.org and read the latest article by Sean Gerety. Let us know what you think of it, OK? I think you'll benefit a lot from it.

Luba.

[lionovjudah]

You laugh Joe , but that is exactly it. I cannot for the life of me determine to discuss any topic under the sun without first acknowledging and understanding that it is all subservient to the sovereign purpose of God.

Try it Joe. Go to any book, chapter, verse and explain it apart from God's sovereign purpose. It becomes idolatry to which we are prone.

Anyways, I would encourage you Joe to seek out the study of eschatology. I mean truth be told, I pray that the Lord would come quickly. To live is Christ, to die is gain.

Ray, I am not discounting that. But read any commentary, read Gills commentary, Each "story" told has meaning.

I have read many sermons on the PRC page, and each are edifying without being in the decree vaccuum.

This is all I am saying.

The Scriptures have many themes, but the central theme from beginning to end is the Covenantal Kingdom of God. Christ spoke more about the Kingdom of God than He did the decrees of God. All others themes encompas this woven thread. Eteranl Decree, redemption, covenants, the fall, incarnation, etc etc, all make up the Kingdom of God.

"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works."
2 Timothy 3:16,17


To speak of Scripture being subservient to the purpose of God is correct Ray. But we must determine why God decreed it. What is the outworking of His decrees means more to me than the decree itself.

He decreed Christ to die for His sheep. That is meaningless to me until it is applied.

So reading the parable of the prodigal son for instance. IF you were to study that, I would certainly hope there is more discussion than "Well God decreed it all to happen this way"

What does the ARK represent? Does it represent the decree, Christ or the Church? Why wee unclean animals present with clean ones? These are studies that edify also Ray.

There is not one instance where Christ answered anyone by pointing to the eternal decree of God.

So if I were to ask you, "Why did Christ die?" Is the only answer "Because God decred it? I hope not. The answer HAS to dwell on what was the Sovereign purpose for God becoming man, and dying on the cross for His sheep.


If I ask you, "Ray, what is the meaning of the parable of the soils?"

Is the only answer, "Well God decreed 25% to grow fruit" No way, these are deep spiritual truths which I enjoy discussingthe application of that.

If not it means nothing.

[lionovjudah]

Joe,

Study of any verse or a passage will lead into the Biblical systematic theology anyway, because it MUST belong to one or more Scriptural doctrines. No verse just sits there in a vacuum by itself, minding its own business. The Bible is One unbroken Word of God, every doctrine relates perfectly to other doctrines and to the whole Bible, and therefore we can never study a verse without considering the rest of the Bible.

If Brandan will allow, you can try - bring a small passage of your choice, and the brothers will help you see its connection to other teachings and to the rest of the beautiful system.

Please go on www.trinityfoundation.org and read the latest article by Sean Gerety. Let us know what you think of it, OK? I think you'll benefit a lot from it.

Luba.

L: I agree, but we should not ever let our systematic trump scripture. Any systematic must use scripture as the rule and barometer, not vice versa.


IF our systematic becomes the rule of thumb, and not the bible, we create our own magesterium as the RCC.


Also systematic theology is a compilation of the whole council of God, not just one part that screams louder than the rest.

B. B. Warfield [1]


Biblical Theology is "the ripest fruit of Exegetics, and Exegetics has not performed its full task until its scattered results in the way of theological data are gathered up into a full and articulated system of Biblical Theology … The task of Biblical Theology, in a word, is the task of coordinating the scattered results of continuous exegesis into a concatenated whole, whether with reference to a single book of Scripture or to a body of related books or to the whole Scriptural fabric ….
"The relation of Biblical Theology to Systematic Theology is based on a true view of its function. Systematic Theology is not founded on the direct and primary results of the exegetical process; it is founded on the final and complete results of exegesis as exhibited in Biblical Theology. Not exegesis itself, then, but Biblical Theology, provides the material for Systematics. Biblical Theology is not, then, a rival of Systematics; it is not even a parallel product of the same body of facts, provided by exegesis; it is the basis and source of Systematics. Systematic Theology is not a concatenation of the scattered theological data furnished by the exegetic process; it is the combination of the already concatenated data given to it by Biblical Theology. It uses the individual data furnished by exegesis, in a word, not crudely, not independently for itself, but only after these data have been worked up into Biblical Theology and have received from it their final coloring and subtlest shades of meaning - in other words, only in their true sense, and after Exegetics has said its last word upon them

"2. Perhaps the greatest enrichment of systematic theology, when it is oriented to biblical theology, is the perspective that is gained for the unity and continuity of special revelation. Orthodox systematic theology rests on the premise of the unity of Scripture, the consent of all the parts. It is this unity that makes valid the hermeneutical principle, the analogy of Scripture. A systematic theology that is faithful to this attribute of Scripture and seeks earnestly to apply it cannot totally fail of its function … Thus the various passages drawn from the whole compass of Scripture and woven into the texture of systematic theology are not cited as mere proof texts or wrested from the scriptural and historical context to which they belong, but, understood in a way appropriate to the place they occupy in this unfolding process, are applied with that particular relevance to the topic under consideration. Texts will not thus be forced to bear a meaning they do not possess nor forced into a service they cannot perform. But in the locus to which they belong and by the import they do possess they will contribute to the sum-total of revelatory evidence by which biblical doctrine is established."

[harald]

I have read with some interest. I have to agree in some with Joe Kinney. God and His word is not all about God decreeing in eternity. This "high grace" something which constantly refers or points to God's eternal decree seemingly looks like something spiritual. It is not. This dwelling, on the part of some, on the eternal decree and in particular on "Justification in Eternity" is not spiritual at all. Paul did not teach justification in eternity "in God".

Paul warned in 2Timothy 4, the last chapter he penned before his demise, that in a coming season people would turn away their ear from the truth and that they would be turned aside onto fictious concepts. This season is also characterized by men heaping to themselves teachers. Never before have religious men and women been heaping to themselves teachers as now, the ear being tickled. And they are wholesale turning away their ear from the truth, and not enduring the healthy teaching. Yes, it is God Himself who has decreed this, and He is actively involved in the fact of religious men and women being turned aside onto the fictious notions, among which notions are:

Justification In Eternity
gospel regeneration
Divine righteousness imputed
preterism
justifying righteousness imputed through faith
Sabbatarianism
Conditional Time Salvation
replacement theology


Today's world of "Calvinism" and "Hyper-Calvinism" is rotting like a corpse. I am personally so sick and tired of it all that I changed to "freewillism" (instead of "hyper-calvinism") in my profile. To make it clear how silly such labels are.

Lastly. There is nothing as effective in this season as exegetically and expositorily teaching through the Pauline epistles verse by verse, provided it is done by a God-called teacher-shepherd. It will confirm true converts in the solid truth of Christ, and shut the mouths of presumptuous gainsayers.


Harald

[Brandan Kraft]

Justification In Eternity
Divine righteousness imputed
replacement theology

It's obvious we aren't united in doctrine Harald. It's a shame.

Today's world of "Calvinism" and "Hyper-Calvinism" is rotting like a corpse. I am personally so sick and tired of it all that I changed to "freewillism" (instead of "hyper-calvinism") in my profile. To make it clear how silly such labels are.

You may think they are silly, but it's one of the board rules to try to be as honest in your profile as possible. If you're not freewillism, then I request that you change your profile.

Lastly. There is nothing as effective in this season as exegetically and expositorily teaching through the Pauline epistles verse by verse, provided it is done by a God-called teacher-shepherd. It will confirm true converts in the solid truth of Christ, and shut the mouths of presumptuous gainsayers.

I have noticed harald that when questions are asked of you, you do tend to get out the greek lexicon and provide an exposition of the particular passage as opposed to logically answering the questions with scripture itself. Scripture is interpreted by Scripture - not a greek lexicon Systematic theology is the tool we have for understanding scripture. We understand things topically, and I believe it is a good thing to try to understand all of Scripture by using Scripture to interpret it!

[InChristAlways]

Today's world of "Calvinism" and "Hyper-Calvinism" is rotting like a corpse. I am personally so sick and tired of it all that I changed to "freewillism" (instead of "hyper-calvinism") in my profile. To make it clear how silly such labels are.

Lastly. There is nothing as effective in this season as exegetically and expositorily teaching through the Pauline epistles verse by verse, provided it is done by a God-called teacher-shepherd. It will confirm true converts in the solid truth of Christ, and shut the mouths of presumptuous gainsayers.

Hi Harald. Paul stands out as a type of "Christ".
One of the most definite statements made by Christ in the book of Acts clearly implies that Paul was to be listened to just as Moses was to be listened to by the Hebrews in the OT.

What is curious is that there is really no mention of Paul prophecied as coming in the OT that I can really see[and why some messianic sites deem him a "false apostle"].

The closest I have come is in the book of Jonah perhaps, when Jonah is "vomited" out of the whale and is told to go to Nineveh to preach[and Jesus does mention him in the NT].
Peter mentions in his letter that Paul is hard to understand, and seeing the confusion in the churches and among christians today, he appears to be right, and on other forums when discussing Paul, TRANSLATIONS appear to be a very big problem, and the best way I have found to get around that is Harmonizing Paul's epistles to the Gospels using lexicons, concordance and multi translations.
Anyway, perhaps a board can be made just on Paul the Apostle but that is up to Brandon but I would love to exegesis Paul's writings. Blessings.

Acts 9:15 But the Lord said to him, "Go, for he is a Chosen Vessel of Mine to bear My Name before Gentiles, kings, and the children of Israel. 16 "For I will show him how many things he must suffer for My Name's sake."

Jonah 2:10 So the LORD spoke to the fish, and it vomited Jonah onto dry [land.]

Jonah 3:1 Now the word of the LORD came to Jonah the second time, saying, 2 "Arise, go to Nineveh, that great city, and preach to it the message that I tell you."

[lionovjudah]

I have noticed harald that when questions are asked of you, you do tend to get out the greek lexicon and provide an exposition of the particular passage as opposed to logically answering the questions with scripture itself. Scripture is interpreted by Scripture - not a greek lexicon Systematic theology is the tool we have for understanding scripture. We understand things topically, and I believe it is a good thing to try to understand all of Scripture by using Scripture to interpret it!

OK, OK, let us settle down here. I asked, it was denied, so I will just start a thread. If anyone would like to discuss that is fine.

The issue is what is sytematic theology Brandan? It is the WHOLE revelation of God, systemised with one section not elevated above the rest.

So to say you use a system, and that system is 99.9% concentrated on the eternal decrees of God is nto a system. Faithful exegesis cannot happen this way because everything is viewed from the one lense. Of course scripture interprets scripture, noone is denyinng that, but topics and systems do not interpret scripture. You end up with an unfaithful eisegesis instead of a proper interpretation.


The Scriptures are the LIVING word of God, who works out His decrees in history. This is what is REVEALED. Yes He is Soveriegn, yes He decreed all that comes to pass. BUT He also brings those decrees to the application of His creations existence.

I mean look at your answer to the philisophical question. Again it was from the lenses of the decree.

That is not satisfactory.

What is more important revelation, that God decreed to send Christ, or the incarnation and life of Christ tabernacling amongst us?

As an aside, I will mark this day down that HArald said he agreed with me!!!!!!!

[ray kikkert]

I have read with some interest. I have to agree in some with Joe Kinney. God and His word is not all about God decreeing in eternity. This "high grace" something which constantly refers or points to God's eternal decree seemingly looks like something spiritual. It is not. This dwelling, on the part of some, on the eternal decree and in particular on "Justification in Eternity" is not spiritual at all. Paul did not teach justification in eternity "in God".

Then Harold, suffice it to say you are setting up idol worship in place of what God does state in Scripture. If His sovereign purpose is not first and foremost you will then have a form of godliness, but lack the power thereof.

Paul warned in 2Timothy 4, the last chapter he penned before his demise, that in a coming season people would turn away their ear from the truth and that they would be turned aside onto fictious concepts. This season is also characterized by men heaping to themselves teachers. Never before have religious men and women been heaping to themselves teachers as now, the ear being tickled.

Harold, you will have to qualify these teachers as false prophets just as Scripture states here, not the half truths of Harold. Unless that is you will now advocate Gill, Calvin, Luther as false prophets. Is that true Harold?

And they are wholesale turning away their ear from the truth, and not enduring the healthy teaching. Yes, it is God Himself who has decreed this, and He is actively involved in the fact of religious men and women being turned aside onto the fictious notions, among which notions are:

Justification In Eternity
gospel regeneration
Divine righteousness imputed
preterism
justifying righteousness imputed through faith
Sabbatarianism
Conditional Time Salvation
replacement theology

This is not surprising , coming from you Harold. I reject some of these points, but as one who confesses the reformed faith as the truth of God's Word, I indeed do advocate others. You do not have that. Your rejection of imputation is the rejection of the reformed faith. Thus we are unequally yoked.

Today's world of "Calvinism" and "Hyper-Calvinism" is rotting like a corpse. I am personally so sick and tired of it all that I changed to "freewillism" (instead of "hyper-calvinism") in my profile. To make it clear how silly such labels are.

Truth be told Harold, the doctrinal positions you take and your despise for the sovereign purpose of God to be acknowledged in every facet of discourse renders you a free willer. Not so silly after all.

Lastly. There is nothing as effective in this season as exegetically and expositorily teaching through the Pauline epistles verse by verse, provided it is done by a God-called teacher-shepherd. It will confirm true converts in the solid truth of Christ, and shut the mouths of presumptuous gainsayers.


Harald

Truth be told to the true converts would be to see the wisdom of God that He has seen fit to reveal in the whole counsel of God, and to repent and believe the Gospel, Not the epistle of Paul alone. Clarification by you is needed here Harold.

[lionovjudah]

I found this quote and agree.

Going through a book of the Bible is a quite marvellous discipline. You know exactly where you are going and do not spend hours every week wondering what your next subject is going to be. 'But I like to preach the gospel,' said one man. Brother; the gospel is on every page. It also means that you have to deal with any difficult texts that arise. There is no dodging the issue. It means too, that the hearers will know exactly where you are coming from, and hopefully, where you are going to. I have found it a marvellous exercise of spirit. I have expounded books like Ephesians, Matthew, Genesis, Romans, Exodus, Revelation, Song of Solomon, Thessalonians, 1 & 2 Peter; Ecclesiastes. I list them just as some come to mind. Series' have always been my happiest days because I believe the Lord has taught me most from them myself. Then there is the exposition of characters. Noah, Joseph - what days we had with Joseph - Moses, Elijah, John the Baptist, Paul, etc.


Expositional Teaching cause us to look for the aid of the blessed Holy Spirit in a very particular way. Most preachers, without any preparation at all, can take fifteen verses of the Bible and spin the time out commenting on each one of them. But let him expound that passage taking the themes in turn, opening up all the available truth in an orderly manner for the understanding of his hearers, and it will take him hours. I once heard John MacArthur say that, on average, his series on Matthew took him fifteen hours for each sermon. Now if that be true for John MacArthur; how is it that young Johnny Shortsides can do it in a matter of twenty minutes? Answer; he's not expounding the passage, he's only commenting on it. God being our helper; let us labour in the greatest of all callings to represent the One who "loved us and gave himself for us." How would we prepare if we knew Jesus was going to be in the pew? He is. "PREACH THE WORD." God bless you, and encourage you, as you work hard at it for His praise and glory.