Eternal life is sure, but Kingdom life is not ?

[katoikei]

Jacob Arminius was not nearly as "Arminian" as many who followed after him.

Arminius did not believe one could lose ones salvation. His statements argued that the verses which teach ones eternal security were very clear. However He argued that the Calvinist's treatment of those scriptures which seemed to teach one could lose one's salvation were unsatisfactory.

In other words He believed that salvation was secured to the beleiver, but did not find satisfactory explination of the passages which seem to teach otherwise to be sufficent.

This was his position and others took it and ran with it to great extreams.

I believe Arminius was closer to the truth than both his followers and the Calvinist. Both views are deficient not recognizing in scripture the distinctions between Eternal Life, the eternal age and the age of the Kingdom which is a reward to faithful, perservering, and overcomming Christians.

D. M. Panton used the illustration from astronomy saying that for years astronomers believed Uranus to be the last planet in the Solar system. However it did not behave properly according to the laws of physics. Then finally when Neptune was discovered, the behaviour of Uranus was explained.

When the distinctions of the Kingdom and the Eternal Life and Eternal Age were brought to light in the scripture in subsequent generations, then all the related scriptures behave properly.

When it is seen that the Apostles (and the Lord Jesus) made this distinction, then it is clear in such passages as "They who do such things shall not inherit the Kingdom of God" and can be reconciled with such things as Pauls assertion in the same epistle conserning the Adultrous brother, "That his spirit might be saved in that day".. etc.

Eternal Life which is the free gift of God in Christ Jesus is seen in distinction from the reward of the Kingdom which only those who "suffer with Him that they might rein with Him", Those who treat their brothers fairly, those who are mature having sufficient oil in their lamps, etc, will enjoy.

When these things are seen clearly, then our fear is abated and we are encouraged to pursue the Lord with all our heart not to avoid eternal judgement and condemnation, but to obtain the prize. Not eternal salvation, but the prize of the Kingdom.

Romans 8:16,17 The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are childern of God and if Children, then heirs. Heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ if so be that we suffer with Him in order that we might also reign with Him."

I have sat under sermons like this my whole life. Eternal life is sure, but Kingdom life is not...Is there ever going to be an end to this ?

In Christ,
Katoikei

[katoikei]

Am I to understand that the quote view above is regarded as either so heretical that no-one wants to even attempt a rebuttal, or is it that it is so true that we are profoundly gobstopped ? Whichever way, would someone please growl, or grunt, or express some vowel sounds, to let me know what you think of such a view ?

In Christ,
Katoikei

[Just Grace]

I think, if any of us think we can have a greater understaning of Christianity to what the Apostles held in their heads ( and hearts ) and also that subsequently the majority of which was written down and come down to us as it has, is in danger of not holding on the the Head, Christ Himself, and will drift and ultimately end up in some heretical thoughts and doctrine.

God wants us to produce the fruit of the Holy Spirit in our lives more than fathoming the deep things of which we cannot know...'how unsearchable are His judgements' etc..

A lot of tall mountains have their peaks hidden by clouds!

[katoikei]

I think, if any of us think we can have a greater understaning of Christianity to what the Apostles held in their heads ( and hearts ) and also that subsequently the majority of which was written down and come down to us as it has, is in danger of not holding on the the Head, Christ Himself, and will drift and ultimately end up in some heretical thoughts and doctrine.

I agree. I know there is something heretical about the quote in the opening post...but...what is it that is heretical about the thoughts and doctrine ?

God wants us to produce the fruit of the Holy Spirit in our lives more than fathoming the deep things of which we cannot know...'how unsearchable are His judgements' etc..

I agree. However, don't you think God also reveals things to us ......................?

A lot of tall mountains have their peaks hidden by clouds!

But then it rains and on a clear day we can see forever...