As we should attempt to glorify God in all things, here's my question: Does not the sun revolve around the earth; or at least the sun has an orbit. Modern science says the earth revolves around the sun, and that the sun is stationary; but the scriptures talk of the sun moving, racing, orbiting, etc. ( Joshua 10:13; Psalm 19:4-6 )........KK
ASk Galileo!!!Originally Posted by Kentucky Kid
As an aside, I always was more interested in whatthis book of Jasher is..
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control. Against such things there is no law.GALATIANS 5:22
Hmm I think it also could be read from the perspective of the people. They are on earth looking out at the sun, so it may have stayed still as in not moved, and yet throughout a whole day it rises and sets, so it moves across the sky. Maybe that is all the Scriptures are reffering to that from earth the sun moves across the sky? Yet we know from people going out into outerspace that it is not the sun moving but the earth which moves. Though I dont think in those days people went into outerspace to understand this.. its just like that whole idea of the earth being flat because it is what people perceived to be the case until discovered otherwise.
Thats just my thought though. And I'm not trying to take science to be truth but there have been more discoveries since when the bible was written. I just see these verses as said out of perspective and not fact from God or something. Maybe... or maybe I'm not seeing the whole picture either. Let me know what you think, thanks for sharing!
Mary
A good name is rather to be chosen than great riches, and loving favour rather than silver and gold. - Wisdom
Lion thanks for you input I'm aware of Galileo's position. As for the book of Jasher: my Bible dictionary says it was a well known book of Hebrew literature of poems, songs, etc. Mary thanks for your input. I agree that maybe it is just the way they saw the situation from earth. BUT God's Word says the sun has a circuit ( Psalm 19:6 KJV ) which means a revolution, a course. I don't take much trust in science. In your "neck of the woods" Mary consider the Mt. St. Helens eruption: scientists previously stated that an eruption like that: it would take 10,000 years for certain vegetation to resurface; some of which has already appeared on the mount. Thanks ya all!......KK
There's an elder at my church who holds to a geocentric model as well as a couple of other people. I know there are theonomists and others who hold to this position as well and a few websites such as this one supporting it: http://www.geocentricity.com/
I find the position interesting to a certain degree but for some reason I haven't studied it alot and don't think it would change how I think about things very much. Atheistic scientists like to point to the passages mentioned and say "Aha! The Bible is wrong!" Others come along and look at the passages and say "Aha! Scientists are wrong!" I'm much more in favor of the second view but I'm not sure that was really the point of the passages. It seems that the person is describing things as he sees them on the earth and not really trying to give a model of a solar system.
If I try to think about it from a purely scientific point of view, I don't think a real answer can even be obtained. I'm afraid I can't explain this as well as I can picture this in my mind but it seems that it would be somewhat arbitrary in a large cosmological model to pick a center point and decide what is going around what. From a certain perspective you could say that everything is revolving aroudn Pluto (it would be an unusual orbit and I think they just voted that Pluto isn't a planet anymore but just picture it in the scope of the entire galaxy and even beyond that.)
For whatever strength of arm he may have who swims in the open sea, yet in time he is carried away and sunk, mastered by the greatness of its waves. Need then there is that we be in the ship, that is, that we be carried in the wood, that we may be able to cross this sea. Now this Wood in which our weakness is carried is the Cross of the Lord, by which we are signed, and delivered from the dangerous tempests of this world.--St. Augustine
No it's not, it revolves around the galaxy at a pace of 217km/s.
For innumerable evils have compassed me about: mine iniquities have taken hold upon me, so that I am not able to look up; they are more than the hairs of mine head: therefore my heart faileth me. (Ps. 40:12)
The galaxies also all move, However as stupid as this sounds it gets me thinking, what if the earth is stationary and every thing else moves? I mean how can you actually find a fixed anchor in space if evey thing is in flux? What if we are stationary and the rest of the canvas is moving? What does it all look like from God's perspective?No it's not, it revolves around the galaxy at a pace of 217km/s.
Sorry to wax metaphysical on "y'all" - (my plural of you)
Isaiah 45:7: I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
Why in the world do we think that Psalm 19 has anything to do with science??
Please re-read the Psalm. From start to finish, the psalmist is using imagery to convey his truth, which is the sovereign glory of God. Why, then, must we apply a literal hermeneutic to this imagery? Obviously we know that the heavens do not "utter speech" to us (verses 1-2). The sun does not sit in a tabernacle. (verse 5) So why, when we read the very next verse, which is clearly intended to put an image in our mind from a human perspective, do we think that he is writing a diatribe on astronomy? His point is that if God can create such a glorious, all-pervading, powerful creation such as the sun, how much more glorious, omnipresent, and powerful is God?
By the way, I licked my Bible expecting it to taste like sweet honey, and instead it tasted like dead cow? I think that I'm going to have a crisis of faith since my senses and the Bible have clearly told me conflicting information.
First I shake the whole Apple tree, that the ripest might fall. Then I climb the tree and shake each limb, and then each branch and then each twig, and then I look under each leaf. ~Martin Luther
Those are not unanswered questions of course, several things probably show that the Earth moves as well and that it's not just everything around us that does. However I can't name one, but if you ask a physicist...
For innumerable evils have compassed me about: mine iniquities have taken hold upon me, so that I am not able to look up; they are more than the hairs of mine head: therefore my heart faileth me. (Ps. 40:12)
Jack, What if it is just the rest of the universe moving?
Would there be a way to prove otherwise?
I have no opinion on any of this, it just got my wheels turning.
Isaiah 45:7: I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
At the risk of sounding uncharacteristically postmodern, after thinking about it for a little while longer, I believe that both positions are right. It really all depends upon your reference point. It would seem that if the solar system were some kind of enclosed model inside of a box somewhere you could say what is revolving around what. But since it's not, the reference point at least from a completely scientific point of view becomes arbitrary. And given the theological superiority of the geocentric model and the fact that we are all living on it(I do wonder about some people sometimes), it makes a good reference point.
For whatever strength of arm he may have who swims in the open sea, yet in time he is carried away and sunk, mastered by the greatness of its waves. Need then there is that we be in the ship, that is, that we be carried in the wood, that we may be able to cross this sea. Now this Wood in which our weakness is carried is the Cross of the Lord, by which we are signed, and delivered from the dangerous tempests of this world.--St. Augustine
Man do we need a topic relevant to the life-and-death issues of our time!
Now see here how sleepy-headed all our opponents are, and how little it helps a man to rely on the ancient fathers, for all their repute down the course of the ages! Were they not all equally blind to, yes, and heeldess of, Paul's clearest and and plainest words?
--Martin Luther
How do you mean, like if the universe itself is revolving around something else? Maybe, but as far as I know nothing points to that as of this year in science, so it would merely be hypothesis.
Which one is that?
Bob are you really 51? Cuz I've never heard a 50+ person express himself like that!
For innumerable evils have compassed me about: mine iniquities have taken hold upon me, so that I am not able to look up; they are more than the hairs of mine head: therefore my heart faileth me. (Ps. 40:12)
Sorry, guys...
I hate to be a party-pooper but I'm going to close this thread. If one of the other MOD's veto my decision to reopen it then I'll understand.
Before I click the close button I wanted to suggest some research items for those of you who are a little confused about our solar system, and it's gravitational orbits.
1) Time.
How is it atomically measured?
Does the gravitational particle-acceleration of the sun have any effect on the cesium atom? If so, why? What is physically happening here? Wha does this tell us about the position of the sun in relation to other planets?
2) Milankovitch cycles.
What are they? Do they play a part in the cycles of seasons? How does the sun play a part in this?
Have fun, and happy researching!!
Thread closed.
Out.
Scott.
"Jesus loves me, this I know, for the Bible tells me so..."
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