Please read the following link:
http://www.monergism.com/short_respo..._macarthur.php
Comments?
Please read the following link:
http://www.monergism.com/short_respo..._macarthur.php
Comments?
Now see here how sleepy-headed all our opponents are, and how little it helps a man to rely on the ancient fathers, for all their repute down the course of the ages! Were they not all equally blind to, yes, and heeldess of, Paul's clearest and and plainest words?
--Martin Luther
In case any are interested, MacArthur said "every self-respecting Calvinist is a pre-millennialist." So all predestinarians past and present who are not disprespect themselves! He also said something along these lines, although the poster could not quote verbatim:
For those who "get it" that God is sovereign and the only one who can determine who will be saved and when they will be saved and is the only one who can save them, A-millennialism makes no sense because it says that Israel, on their own, forfeited the promises.
I believe the poster heard correctly and understood MacArthur's pathetic nonsense for what it was!
Now see here how sleepy-headed all our opponents are, and how little it helps a man to rely on the ancient fathers, for all their repute down the course of the ages! Were they not all equally blind to, yes, and heeldess of, Paul's clearest and and plainest words?
--Martin Luther
MacArthur makes absolutely no sense at all! Just another typical (zionist) chialist, who is awaiting Jesus Christ, to sit on His thrown in literal Jerusalem, in the literal restored temple for a literal 1,000 years. Of course after the US/Israel alliance wipes out the dome of the Rock.
I wonder If Jesus has to go to Vatican City, Rome first to get the Chair of Peter first and move it to the temple in Jerusalem?
Do you think Jesus and the Pope are going to argue who becomes head of the Church?
I'm being a little facetious for now. I dont recal exactly, but I remember watching the John Ankerburg show. John was having a question/answer session with R.C. Sproul, D.James Kennedy, and MacArthur. They reminded of the "Three Blind Mice".
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand..........John 10:27,28
The Ankerburg show was a forum of the 4 men on the issue of Roman Catholic vs. Protestant views of justification; it occurred approx. 6-7 years ago I believe. I saw a tape of it for sale in the bookstore at MacArthur's Grace Community Church--it was around 2002 or early 2003. They probably are still selling it!
I can still remember sitting in GCC back around 1999, hearing John teach that God was certainly going to restore the physical nation of Israel and the majority of 'Jews' to faith as a testimony to the power of the gospel, and PRAYING that God would somehow take action against the false teaching that he was promoting! The rest of his message that day had been glorious truth up until he said that.
This latest statement by John only confirms and illustrates the irrational but real power that historic churchmen have over their followers. The popular churches differ in doctrine almost endlessly, yet every one of them has the same leader/follower mentality and conviction that it alone possesses and teaches the truth!
Now see here how sleepy-headed all our opponents are, and how little it helps a man to rely on the ancient fathers, for all their repute down the course of the ages! Were they not all equally blind to, yes, and heeldess of, Paul's clearest and and plainest words?
--Martin Luther
This is the one area I have a problem with John MacArthur's teaching. I respect him as a teacher in other areas of doctrine, but on this point as quoted, this is somewhat insulting to anyone who disagrees with him.Originally Posted by Robert R. Higby
A careful study of the scriptures reveals that there is only one more visitation of the Lord Jesus Christ. Where he and many others gets the notion based on ALL of scripture that Christians will miss the tribulation, is anybody's guess.
We need to pray for John and others concerning this. It is worth noting that John once didn't believe in the Eternal Sonship of Jesus Christ, but recanted his position, and converted to orthodoxy on this issue. So he is willing to change on things as God leads.
Gods' blessings to you,
Kevin.
Last edited by Highlyfavored; 05-17-2008 at 09:58 AM.
Thanks Kevin!
Just to make clear, I do not outrightly oppose all differing positions on eschatology other than my own. These are the views that I and others find obviously unbiblical and opposed to the principles of the gospel:
1. Pure Preterism. The notion that there is no final Advent of Jesus Christ to occur in the future because all of prophetic scripture, including that of a final Advent, has already been completely fulfilled.
2. Dominion Theology. This is a form of postmillennialism that teaches a long age of future Christian dominance over the masses of the world through a union with civil government. It often also involves some notion of universal restoration of aspects of the law of Moses.
3. Hybrid Chiliasm. This is any teaching of a future millennium after Christ's final Advent involving a mixture of spirit and flesh; i.e., glorified and 'improved' fleshly humanity living and interacting together in an earthly paradise.
Thanks again, --Bob
Now see here how sleepy-headed all our opponents are, and how little it helps a man to rely on the ancient fathers, for all their repute down the course of the ages! Were they not all equally blind to, yes, and heeldess of, Paul's clearest and and plainest words?
--Martin Luther
Re: MacArthur's Continued Premillenial Idiocy
Just a question, because I know absolutely nothing about pre-millenialism, historicism, and those isms..lol...but it seems like you are talking about pre-tribulationalism vs, mid or post trib....???
I'm so confused...help.......
Dead faith is only possible if you are not ALIVE in Christ!
“Do as you are bid; feed the sheep, feed the lambs; the goats will never believe the gospel,
though they may believe your doctrine.”
William Huntington
Augustus Toplady (1740-1778) was John Wesley's chief opponent
Oh, I'm post-trib, btw....that much I do know......
Dead faith is only possible if you are not ALIVE in Christ!
“Do as you are bid; feed the sheep, feed the lambs; the goats will never believe the gospel,
though they may believe your doctrine.”
William Huntington
Augustus Toplady (1740-1778) was John Wesley's chief opponent
The pre-trib and mid-trib views both resulted from the emergence of the system of prophetic interpretation known as Dispensationalism. According to the research of Dave MacPherson, the initial origin of this system was rooted in the beginning of what is more commonly termed the second advent awakening movement. It started with the views of a Roman Catholic Jesuit priest (Manuel Lacunza) on the second coming published around 1800, the name of the book was 'The Coming of Messiah in Glory and Majesty'.
http://poweredbychrist.com/Manuel_Lacunza.html
Lacunza was not the originator of the pre-trib rapture belief itself; instead it grew out of his basic doctrine of the 'pre-wrath sealing' of the church. This pre-wrath sealing doctrine of Lacunza laid the basis of the entire dispensationalist system of interpretation, whether pre-trib or mid-trib. The doctrine of the pre-trib rapture itself originated with the teachings of Edward Irving in 1829-30. Irving was dependent on Lacunza for his prophetic perspective.
On the matter of post-tribulationism (which most of the contributors here accept), there are differences of what constitutes the 'tribulation.' We could discuss that in more detail--I'm not sure when we last had a thread on that subject.
Now see here how sleepy-headed all our opponents are, and how little it helps a man to rely on the ancient fathers, for all their repute down the course of the ages! Were they not all equally blind to, yes, and heeldess of, Paul's clearest and and plainest words?
--Martin Luther
I found a few things of interest here:
http://www.historicism.net/
Isaiah 45:7: I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
Thanks for trying Greg....
I read that page, and then went to the link at the bottom, having to do with a debate with a preterist...why can't they use plain language, I never can make heads nor tails out of that mess....but to say that Jesus is not returning bodily is just plain wrong anyway, so I can see why they would try to disguise what they are really trying to say....
Dead faith is only possible if you are not ALIVE in Christ!
“Do as you are bid; feed the sheep, feed the lambs; the goats will never believe the gospel,
though they may believe your doctrine.”
William Huntington
Augustus Toplady (1740-1778) was John Wesley's chief opponent
MacArthur is such a great man of God and so sharp in so many other areas. He does have some problems in this area and it upsets me sometimes. But i have to come to his defense. He has a great gift for teaching and Apologetics. He is an avid defender of the faith.
Btw--I do not believe MacArthur himself is an idiot, just that he made a truly idiotic statement that shows great disrespect for OTHER defenders of the faith on his part.
Now see here how sleepy-headed all our opponents are, and how little it helps a man to rely on the ancient fathers, for all their repute down the course of the ages! Were they not all equally blind to, yes, and heeldess of, Paul's clearest and and plainest words?
--Martin Luther
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